TOPIC:

webmst007 wrote:

I think the storm ART is currently only up to a certain frequency (150Hz or maybe it's 300 or 350Hz - can't remember 🤣).
so maybe full range won't happen until next year or after they've ironed out the major  links in it's operation at that range.
so for me it would do multisubs ( I use 4 in a Harmon- like array ) which would be really nice to do through either my avr( hopefully a new rmc1+ ) but more likely through a minidsp I think when it's released with that version of Dirac ( I know - born optimist me 🤣🤣😁👌😂).

The point re. full-range main speakers relates to bass extension. You couldn't use bass-limited standmounts to output lower frequencies to work in tandem with subwoofers. Over the region of ART being applied, the more appropriately capable sources than can be employed the better the results would be. It's also the low bass where the clear benefit would come. I've no idea if there are plans to try to apply it over a wider frequency range but its the low bass where the science is pretty clear it will have real benefits.

I saw some of the early Dirac presentations where the discussion was about the ART system intending to be full range and integrate the Dirac  multi subs application with Dirac live into ART.
I don't know if that's changed or just shelved while they sort out ART for just the lower  range.
And I agree with you - sorting that out is the low hanging fruit in this endeavour.

ART will never be full range, if by that you mean going all the way up to 20 kHz. It works up to a certain frequency then above that it's just Dirac Live (one speaker per channel with no support speakers).
 

Well I think Dirac ART is intended to go a lot higher than 150Hz and just manage subs.
I was discussing with someone invloved in the Dirac project how various speaker designs may potentially perform when used with Dirac ART ( I play with electrostatic speaker design)  and regarding frequency range he mentioned:
"The way Dirac's new correction works is going to be agnostic to the speakers in use. A box is not needed.  The enclosure is irrelevant.  Any source can be used to actively cancel a reflection.  

This is very different from what Nelson Pass or PSI did. There are two important differences. PSI and Nelson pass were only concerned with room modes in the range from say 20hz to 100hz. Their devices were not intended to counteract problematic reflections at 500hz. In fact doing so would have caused audible distortions. Diracs approach can cancel reflections at much higher frequencies. The audibility of those artifacts depends on the speaker location and so this is not a universal magic capability, but in the right setup you could see no meaningful reflections in the room out to 500hz and beyond. 

The second distinct difference is that this is not an IIR cancelation. This is a mixed phase cancelation. What that means is that cancelation at those frequencies over 100hz can happen far more completely.  A far more complex wavefront can be managed than is possible with these older and much simpler approaches."

So I think the intention for the current Storm Dirac ART project is probably only a starting point and for the system to expand to include higher frequency response range as it matures.

webmst007 wrote:

The second distinct difference is that this is not an IIR cancelation. This is a mixed phase cancelation. What that means is that cancelation at those frequencies over 100hz can happen far more completely.  A far more complex wavefront can be managed than is possible with these older and much simpler approaches."'

'Normal' Dirac Live is not just IIR either, or it wouldn't be able to make the phase corrections it does. If ART is using IIR less for lower frequencies then this would place additional demands on the hardware though.

On the frequency range question, it's not immediately obvious to me how ART could be applied above the low bass without the sounds arriving from different directions being an issue.

webmst007 wrote:

Well I think Dirac ART is intended to go a lot higher than 150Hz and just manage subs.

It already "goes higher" than 150 Hz, that is just the default setting. It doesn't just use subs, it uses all the speakers.

speakee wrote:

webmst007 wrote:

Well I think Dirac ART is intended to go a lot higher than 150Hz and just manage subs.

It already "goes higher" than 150 Hz, that is just the default setting. It doesn't just use subs, it uses all the speakers.

Possibly this is out of date but the following says that the maximum frequency ART can be applied to is adjustable in the 50 to 150 Hz range (with normal Dirac Live being used above this):

confluence.dirac.services/display/DLS/Di...reatment+Setup+Guide

Ah. That would be current, I expect.

Agreed on both counts - we had those conversations around 8 months ago and this is the current Dirac ART implementation advice and explanexplanation.So it will be interesting to see if Dirac expands ART in future versions or if this is the full extent of ART and, as you say, it is essentially Dirac Live above the current ART range.
from my verbal conversations at the time ( late last year ) I did get the impression that Dirac intended to implement ART full range - so maybe this has proved impractical or undesirable for some reason. 
on another note - the 88A I see is on backorder - I wonder if the successor to this line would be a suitable candidate for a first Dirac multisub/ART capable unit from minidsp ?