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headroom & output voltage 3 months 5 days ago #62586

  • JaapDeventer
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I'll ad an example from my experience with SHD Studio. In my former set up I had the SHD between streamer and integrated amp. So I could choose between using the amps volume control or use the SHD Studio. I chose to use the volume of the amp and used 0db setting at SHD Studio. I did experience distortion. Especially with cymbals hitting certain notes at frequencies where Dirac was adjusting above 3db. I tried changing SHD output to - 10dB but didn't like the result. To solve this issue I made the Dirac curve follow the deepest valleys so it would not exceed +3db attenuation. That worked fine with SHD at 0dB output.
Nowadays I have SHD Studio to Ares dac to power amp and use volume control of the SHD. 

 

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Last edit: by JaapDeventer.

headroom & output voltage 3 months 5 days ago #62587

  • edmundpan
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I believe in the future Dirac will let user limit the gain compensation.  I had a Beringrer DEQ2496 15 years ago and it could do that....

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Last edit: by edmundpan.

headroom & output voltage 3 months 4 days ago #62593

  • notman
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0db is not a level.....unless it's referenced to something.  Don't get confused by this.
0dbV = 1 volt RMS, 0dbV = 2.2dbu, etc, etc.  Otherwise it's a meaningless number regards actual signal level.

In the simplest case.....if you program and/or input enough level in the DSP portion to fill up the DAC input with all 1's, the output (of the DAC) will clip.
Normally, any analog stages following a DAC will be designed to have a higher voltage clipping point than the DAC output itself.  Thus, any clipping you experience will be "digital" clipping.

Dave.


 

This is a good point. What I was trying to convey is that, in our specific case with the SHD, the input meters and 0db is referenced to the 2V RCA / 4V XLR max input voltage, and on the output meters, they are referenced to the same voltages but in that case max output. I think knowing those numbers and keeping them in mind can be helpful for people to understand what’s going on and how it relates to things like power amp input sensitivity.

Also it helps illustrate the precipitous drop in voltage by setting -10db on the master volume regardless of what’s actually going on at the outputs. In cases where someone wouldn’t be clipping all the way up to 2V, if they just follow blanket instructions on setting -10db master volume then the best they’re going to get out of their outputs is .63V, well below the input sensitivity of any amp and that could be compounded by insensitive speakers. Definitely not always the case, with a lot of modern music via digital sources you won’t have the room to do that, but with a quieter source you can easily see someone saying, “I can’t get enough signal to my power amp” and it’s because they neutered their output by reading the SHD manual.

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headroom & output voltage 3 months 4 days ago #62594

  • dreite
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Yeah, that's just what I said back in Post 62558.  :)
This is not a complicated topic.  It's very simple to understand what is happening (and can happen) within the gain structure regards clipping.

Where it gets confusing is when folks associate various subjective evaluation aspects to differing programming schemes within that gain structure.  :)
That's why I suggested to the OP to configure it however it sounds best to him and call it good.

Dave.

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Last edit: by dreite. Reason: edit

headroom & output voltage 3 months 3 days ago #62598

  • asx77
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if they just follow blanket instructions on setting -10db master volume then the best they’re going to get out of their outputs is .63V

funnily enough I run the SHD directly into valve power amps with an input sensitivity of 0.6v for 28W at 1% distortion (mainly 2nd harmonic). Giving it more input voltage will produce more than 28W but at greater distortion. I guess I run a higher risk of analogue clipping. 
Warning: Just because I'm a 'Platinum' member, doesn't mean I know what I'm talking about... It just means I've asked too many questions!!

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Last edit: by asx77.
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