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TOPIC: Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges

Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 9 months ago #4727

  • nyt
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nyt wrote:
Thanks for the update! Glad it hasn't been forgotten about. Hopefully the previous work makes it easier to do the other filter types.

devteam wrote:
Unfortunately, no progress on this as we've been tied up upgrading some firmware for the IR feature and preparing some upcoming product release. The SubPeak Equation having taken a lot of engineering time and resources to achieve it, it's no simple task by any means I'm afraid.

Hoping we can find some time in the near future

DevTeam

Hi, any news on this?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 8 months ago #5130

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Anything? I'm using the latest firmware and even with the sub eq it is completely inaccurate. Has there been a regression? Is it possible to use the 8x8 firmware on a 2x8 and reduce math errors?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 8 months ago #5152

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Does anyone read this forum anymore?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 8 months ago #5153

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Does anyone read this forum anymore?
Sure we do and still do our best to answer all questions within 72h... There is just a wee bit more than one person here asking question.. :-)

I'm not sure what you mean by regression... The firmware (i.e. software embedded inside the DSP) only being here to enable the IR. The software (plug-in) was the one fixing the problem for the SubEQ. There wasn't any change on the code as far as we're aware but we could investigate again to see if there was a change. Let us get back to you with that regards once our engineering team looks into it.

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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 8 months ago #5155

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devteam wrote:
Does anyone read this forum anymore?
Sure we do and still do our best to answer all questions within 72h... There is just a wee bit more than one person here asking question.. :-)

I'm not sure what you mean by regression... The firmware (i.e. software embedded inside the DSP) only being here to enable the IR. The software (plug-in) was the one fixing the problem for the SubEQ. There wasn't any change on the code as far as we're aware but we could investigate again to see if there was a change. Let us get back to you with that regards once our engineering team looks into it.

DevTeam

Yeah I was more referring to the month+ old post that nobody answered =] It's ok though.

Anyway, will running the 10x10 plugin on the 2x8 hardware reduce the problems in low frequency ranges since its 48khz instead of 96khz?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 8 months ago #5166

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Will running the 10x10 plugin on the 2x8 hardware reduce the problems in low frequency ranges since its 48khz instead of 96khz?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5205

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@ nyt,

We can only say as much as we said on Friday: we'll have our engineering team have a look at the case and your statement that there was something changed in the latest release.. We'll also run again some test to compare with the 48kHz.

Hoping this clarifies.

DevTeam

PS: We'd appreciate no double posting. Thanks for your understanding. :)
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Last Edit: 5 years 7 months ago by devteam.
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5311

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devteam wrote:
@ nyt,

We can only say as much as we said on Friday: we'll have our engineering team have a look at the case and your statement that there was something changed in the latest release.. We'll also run again some test to compare with the 48kHz.

Hoping this clarifies.

DevTeam

PS: We'd appreciate no double posting. Thanks for your understanding. :)

Hi, any news?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5374

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Any word as to whether 48khz plugin performs better? If you want to send it to me I will test.

Also, any chance on a 24khz plugin for 2x8?
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5393

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@ nyt,

Sorry for the delay... It's been a rough week for the team. Thanks for your patience!

- No change on the code for the SubEQ and it tested similar between previous and current version. Which platform are you using? Windows? Maybe easiest that you email to our team so we can see what you mean otherwise we'll consider this issue closed.

- The 48kHz does perform more accurately at 48kHz in the SUB EQ position than the 96kHz. You can have a try at it.

- As for a 24kHz 2x8 plug-in, I think that we have to be honest that the chances are quite low. The majority of our end users doing either 3way or 4way configuration (i.e. won't find any use for a 24kHz plug-in) and if they were to do multisub (i.e. 3-4sub), a 2x4 unit would be a better fit. In other words, I'm sure that you're already aware that your application (i.e. 8xOutputs for more than 4subs is quite unique... :-) Or if it is out there, it's quite limited compared to most common systems.

It doesn't mean that we won't do it but to be fair with the miniDSP community, there are a lot of members here that would like other features to be developed. The SubEQ was already developed as per your request so we have to try to be fair and allow our community to enjoy other feature request as per the spirit of the miniDSP Community. Hoping you agree. :-)

DevTeam
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5398

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devteam wrote:
@ nyt,

Sorry for the delay... It's been a rough week for the team. Thanks for your patience!

- No change on the code for the SubEQ and it tested similar between previous and current version. Which platform are you using? Windows? Maybe easiest that you email to our team so we can see what you mean otherwise we'll consider this issue closed.

- The 48kHz does perform more accurately at 48kHz in the SUB EQ position than the 96kHz. You can have a try at it.

- As for a 24kHz 2x8 plug-in, I think that we have to be honest that the chances are quite low. The majority of our end users doing either 3way or 4way configuration (i.e. won't find any use for a 24kHz plug-in) and if they were to do multisub (i.e. 3-4sub), a 2x4 unit would be a better fit. In other words, I'm sure that you're already aware that your application (i.e. 8xOutputs for more than 4subs is quite unique... :-) Or if it is out there, it's quite limited compared to most common systems.

It doesn't mean that we won't do it but to be fair with the miniDSP community, there are a lot of members here that would like other features to be developed. The SubEQ was already developed as per your request so we have to try to be fair and allow our community to enjoy other feature request as per the spirit of the miniDSP Community. Hoping you agree. :-)

DevTeam
Hi,

Thanks for the reply.

The problem with the 2x4 units is the low line levels. I'm actually only using 2 outputs from the 2x8, but it supports 8 volt balanced line levels as opposed to 2v. If the 2x4 would support higher voltages, I would be using one of those, as it is all that I need. I'm using 2 input channels and 2 output channels.

I will try the 48khz platform and see if it works a little better. Trying to EQ around 15-25hz with 96khz is an exercise in futility, as it introduces too many math errors to provide anything useful. I'd love to see a 24khz plugin for this hardware, or hardware that runs a 24khz plugin and supports high voltage balanced line levels. If you have any suggestions for this, I'm all ears. I don't mind buying new hardware if that is what it will take. Also, what kind of costs would it be to get a 24khz plugin for the 2x8 platform developed?

I have a dip around 17-18hz and a couple peaks slightly above 20hz that I am trying to EQ out, but with the 96khz plugin there isn't enough control.

This is unsmoothed, great results above 25hz, but below that not enough control.


For amusement, this is the full system:

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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5403

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Wow, this setup might be able to blow you away ;-) Very impressive! Thanks for sharing :)

To be honest, I don't think that it would make that much difference (if any) to EQ the small deviations around 18Hz (man, it's < +/- 2dB and probably not perceived aurally). Don't you think this is somehow pedantic ;) On the other hand, such perfectionists like you keep thinks rollin' ;)

What about using a 2x4 plus a small Opamp circuit (DIY balanced line driver, or google for available products) to increase (and maybe balance) the output? Such a circuit is quite easy to set up and compared to the complete effort you put in your system this will be just "noise" ;)

Daniel
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5404

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curryman wrote:
Wow, this setup might be able to blow you away ;-) Very impressive! Thanks for sharing :)

To be honest, I don't think that it would make that much difference (if any) to EQ the small deviations around 18Hz (man, it's < +/- 2dB and probably not perceived aurally). Don't you think this is somehow pedantic ;) On the other hand, such perfectionists like you keep thinks rollin' ;)

What about using a 2x4 plus a small Opamp circuit (DIY balanced line driver, or google for available products) to increase (and maybe balance) the output? Such a circuit is quite easy to set up and compared to the complete effort you put in your system this will be just "noise" ;)

Daniel

Thanks. I'm trying to keep the noise floor as low as possible and as much headroom as possible. Even 2v input will clip fairly easy at the boosted levels I run this system at. I'm going to give the 48khz plugin a shot soon though and see if its any better. As for the good results, I was messing with almost random filters for a long time before I managed to find a combination to get it like that. It would be trivial to get that flat if the filters behaved as they should.
Last Edit: 5 years 7 months ago by nyt.
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5405

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Wow, that's indeed a beautiful setup you've got there NYT!! Thanks for sharing..
Mind posting that pic in the Subwoofer showcase section? We've created a Sub section here:
www.minidsp.com/forum/16-subwoofer-tuning

Thanks for clarifying your setup. You actually need a lot less I/O than expected and we didn't realize that you were after the high level Input/output. When you say you might saturate, do you mean that you have a source (at the input side of the DSP) that outputs more than 2Vrms or is it more that after processing, you may have more peak/EQ that is over the 2Vrms. Most proAV amps can be tuned for 1.4Vrms sensitivity but it's not for all...

We actually like the idea of a Sub proc though... We could put some thinking into the major features required to make it happen. Low sample rate is key for one, but there might be others required.

DevTeam
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Re: 4x10 problems in low frequency ranges 5 years 7 months ago #5406

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devteam wrote:
Wow, that's indeed a beautiful setup you've got there NYT!! Thanks for sharing..
Mind posting that pic in the Subwoofer showcase section? We've created a Sub section here:
www.minidsp.com/forum/16-subwoofer-tuning

Thanks for clarifying your setup. You actually need a lot less I/O than expected and we didn't realize that you were after the high level Input/output. When you say you might saturate, do you mean that you have a source (at the input side of the DSP) that outputs more than 2Vrms or is it more that after processing, you may have more peak/EQ that is over the 2Vrms. Most proAV amps can be tuned for 1.4Vrms sensitivity but it's not for all...

We actually like the idea of a Sub proc though... We could put some thinking into the major features required to make it happen. Low sample rate is key for one, but there might be others required.

DevTeam

Thanks, I'll put up a post with some information and pics in the subwoofer forum after I get some sleep. For now, all the information is at countercultured.net/pics/ht

I'm running denon 5308 sub outs to the minidsp, and then the minidsp connected to lap gruppen FP14000 clones. The way the system is currently calibrated is that my subs are leveled properly to the mains at -12db on the receiver, which is the minimum. Sometimes listening to music at high levels, it will be boosted to +12db, and the receiver set to high levels as well. It takes a good bit of voltage to get over 130db output levels on a system that can still play at regular levels, hence the need for the 2x8. The minidsp never sees much signal above 200hz, so sample rate isn't terribly important here.

Please let me know what you guys decide to do, as I know there are a good deal of people wanting a high end sub equalizer.
Last Edit: 5 years 7 months ago by nyt.
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