Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me
NOTE: This is a "Community" forum. Please be mindful that community members are here to help as part of a community effort. We therefore appreciate your effort in keeping this forum a happy place!

If you have a specific issue (e.g. hardware, failure) and want help from our support team, please use our tech support portal (Support menu - > Contact Us).
Thanks a lot of your help in making a better community.

TOPIC: Way to go for vinyl through SHD

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49522

Hi everyone,

I'd like to start with saying I am another happy user of MiniDSP SHD, but I can't. I'm not.
The fact is I didn't go for activation of Dirac, because of what I heard plugging it by itself have cutted my wings.

I connected SHD to my Technics SL-1210GR through Audio Research Phono PH-5 and Linn Klout poweramp to Snell KIII. It blew me.
Unbelieveable harshness and brightness comming of vinyl.
My question is making an equalisation via Dirac would make any difference?
Personally I don't think so, if the basic output quality is that bad.
I don't want to activate the code yet so I won't close my way of returning it back to store.

Have anyone experienced such thing? Is it fixable?

The DAC section is more than acceptable, but it's not main way I wanted to use SHD. It means bypassing integrared tube amplifier to listen to punk/hc music using turntable in warmer days.

Hope to hear from you guys,
have a nice day!
Last Edit: 2 months 4 weeks ago by johnnykiller.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49524

  • entripy
  • entripy's Avatar
  • Online
  • Expert Boarder
  • Posts: 154
  • Thank you received: 43
  • Karma: 3
SHD is exceptionally neutral tonally so is unlikely to be the cause of the harshness and brightness but traditional vinyl replay equipment has always been sensitive to carefully matching components. It is possible that there's some impedance or other sort of mismatch between components that inserting the SHD has changed. The SHD by itself will not cause harshness or brightness assuming you haven't added such equalisation in the plugin. Dirac is unlikely to help, it really only deals with speakers and room and I suspect your issue is at the front end, not at the back end. My Linn/Naim front end sounds just fine through an SHD for what it's worth.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49525

  • chrissy
  • chrissy's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Expert Boarder
  • Posts: 91
  • Thank you received: 23
  • Karma: 2
Hi,
I can only agree with entripy. My TT , and its not a bad one ;), runs very fine with SHD, so its definitively not a matter of SHD.
Greets
Chris
SHD as Preamp, Squeezelite player and roomcorrection.
Nubert nuVero 60, 2x Elac 2070 Sub, XTZ EDGE A2-300 power amp. Acoustic solid Machine record player, SME 4 Tonearm, Nagaoka MP 500 cartridge,
FI Micro iPhono2 phono preamp, HiFiMan HE1000 SE, Phonitor X phone amp
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49527

  • mvs0
  • mvs0's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Senior Boarder
  • Posts: 44
  • Thank you received: 5
  • Karma: 0
johnnykiller wrote:
Hi everyone,


I connected SHD to my Technics SL-1210GR through Audio Research Phono PH-5 and Linn Klout poweramp to Snell KIII. It blew me.
Unbelieveable harshness and brightness comming of vinyl.


Just to be 100% sure: so its connected as this ? :
Technics SL-1210GR -> Audio Research Phono PH-5 -> RCA input of SHD -> Linn Klout poweramp


Also did you check if maybe the input of the SHD is clipping? (look at the level meters at "routing" in the SHD app)
The administrator has disabled public write access.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Ultrasonic

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49528

  • Ultrasonic
  • Ultrasonic's Avatar
  • Online
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 741
  • Thank you received: 139
  • Karma: 14
mvs0 wrote:
johnnykiller wrote:
Just to be 100% sure: so its connected as this ? :
Technics SL-1210GR -> Audio Research Phono PH-5 -> RCA input of SHD -> Linn Klout poweramp


Also did you check if maybe the input of the SHD is clipping? (look at the level meters at "routing" in the SHD app)

Exactly the two things I was about to ask!
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49536

I assume it's the only right way to connect the gear, hahaha

As I said before, I haven't used SHD software yet, so I could be able to return it back to store. So I can't see if signal is overdriven.
I pick up the gear carefully, to match imperance etc.

Manual of my phonostage says: "RATED OUTPUTS: .50V RMS 10Hz to 60kHz, 100K ohm load (output capability is 50V RMS output at 1/2 (half)% THD at 1kHz)"
Maximum input RMS voltage of SHD is 2V unbalanced.
Maybe this the cause of my problems?

Thanks for all replies!!
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49537

  • Ultrasonic
  • Ultrasonic's Avatar
  • Online
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 741
  • Thank you received: 139
  • Karma: 14
johnnykiller wrote:
As I said before, I haven't used SHD software yet...

Do you mean you haven't checked the settings in the SHD plugin at all? If so it's possible there is a crossover filter being applied that is messing up the sound. On at least some miniDSPs the default isn't with no filters at all applied unfortunately.

Edit: checking what the sound is like using outputs 3 and 4 rather than 1 and 2 could give you a clue.
Last Edit: 2 months 4 weeks ago by Ultrasonic.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49538

  • mvs0
  • mvs0's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Senior Boarder
  • Posts: 44
  • Thank you received: 5
  • Karma: 0
johnnykiller wrote:

Manual of my phonostage says: "RATED OUTPUTS: .50V RMS 10Hz to 60kHz, 100K ohm load (output capability is 50V RMS output at 1/2 (half)% THD at 1kHz)"
Maximum input RMS voltage of SHD is 2V unbalanced.
Maybe this the cause of my problems?

Thanks for all replies!!

Given the high gain of your preamp clipping seems to be possible.. install SHD on your pc and check! (this will not void your right to return the SHD as far as I know :) )

(btw: 50 volts! that could fry an input ... maybe an attenuator would be adviced for this pre-amp :) )
Last Edit: 2 months 4 weeks ago by mvs0.
The administrator has disabled public write access.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Ultrasonic

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49540

  • Ultrasonic
  • Ultrasonic's Avatar
  • Online
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 741
  • Thank you received: 139
  • Karma: 14
mvs0 wrote:
(btw: 50 volts! that could fry an input ... maybe an attenuator would be adviced for this pre-amp :) )

It would but there's a sneaky decimal point you missed - it's 0.50 V :) .
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49543

  • mvs0
  • mvs0's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Senior Boarder
  • Posts: 44
  • Thank you received: 5
  • Karma: 0
Ultrasonic wrote:
mvs0 wrote:
(btw: 50 volts! that could fry an input ... maybe an attenuator would be adviced for this pre-amp :) )

It would but there's a sneaky decimal point you missed - it's 0.50 V :) .

.5 volt would be kind of low... and the spec also says:
"(output capability is 50VRMS output at 1/2% THD at 1kHz)"
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49544

  • entripy
  • entripy's Avatar
  • Online
  • Expert Boarder
  • Posts: 154
  • Thank you received: 43
  • Karma: 3
Yes, but 50V is the absolute maximum (Rated).
"Less than .005% at .50V RMS 1kHz output." from the spec is probably a more typical level.
Sadly levels in specs are almost always useless, the only way to really know is to measure it.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49545

  • Ultrasonic
  • Ultrasonic's Avatar
  • Online
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 741
  • Thank you received: 139
  • Karma: 14
I just checked the specs here:

www.arcdb.ws/model/PH5

So it is 50 V but like @Entripy says I suspect this is a maximum possible rather than what is typical. It seems unnecessarily overspecced to be honest.

Checking for clipping in the plugin as originally suggested seems the most sensible option to know for sure if there is an issue (which there could be).
Last Edit: 2 months 4 weeks ago by Ultrasonic.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49546

I followed Ultrasonic's advice to run a software.
Good thing is that signal isn't clipping. It does reach high, but not too high to overdrive.
Bad thing is I had to go to work so I can't figure it out till monday morning.
When I get back home I'll make measurements and try to make a signal levels change and EQ.
Last Edit: 2 months 4 weeks ago by johnnykiller.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49547

  • Ultrasonic
  • Ultrasonic's Avatar
  • Online
  • Platinum Boarder
  • Posts: 741
  • Thank you received: 139
  • Karma: 14
johnnykiller wrote:
When I get back home I'll make measurements and try to make a signal levels change and EQ.

Before you do that you want to check the current plugin settings, most specifically the signal routing and crossover settings. You want to understand the problem you started the thread about before starting to mess with EQ.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Way to go for vinyl through SHD 2 months 4 weeks ago #49559

Sadly, I must admit, that the signal clipps. It's overdriven by phono pre.

Is there anything I can do about it? Besides changing semiconductor components in pre? The lower load I set, the lower signal gets.
The problem is I am currently using MM cartridge which needs 47k load. When I set 100, like for an MC cart it sounds like the sound is coming from behind the wall. Bass gets low and muddy, overall volume gets low so I have to put on gain, which causes noise to appear.
Honestly I don't want to step into MC. If equalisating curve won't give any results I'll think about selling SHD...
The administrator has disabled public write access.
Moderators: devteam