TOPIC:

Dear Pos,

Would it be difficult to add a step response calculator for the generated filters?

Thank you,

Andrey

Hello Audrey,
You mean a graphical representation of the step response of the filter (or filter+measurement) ?

pos wrote:

You mean a graphical representation of the step response of the filter (or filter+measurement) ?

A graphical representation of the step response of the filter. It would be very useful for, say, designing steep crossovers that still don't ring excessively etc.

Thank you,
Andrey

That would be useful indeed, but would require even more work than the GD representation, so probably not going to happen very soon, sorry

For now you can see how the step, impulse, etc. look like by loading it in REW, with many options that would anyway not be practical to add in rephase.

Thank you for your REW suggestion. It seems to be a practical (albeit partial) solution, indeed.

Thanks Pos!

I was a bit rusty on HOLM but that ABC feature worked like a charm
I’m not a huge fan of “mathy” UI’s but can Eiffel my way through slowly. I’m finding a lot of really neat uses with HOLM now.



So , yeah some way to see time would be so nice.

I HAVE AN IDEA

what about a separate window (graph within the UI separate from the mag/phase graph) that shows the GD on a frequency scale, but as you make corrections within rePhase the GD window would just show a prediction on the effects of GD based on whatever the user does . Obviously no controls to “adjust” GD independently just a second window that shows the GD per frequency on the impulse and the effects the fir will have on GD. To simplify it even just a excess GD is probably all I would need, don’t know how that would work as it has to be extracted, but if there’s a way to let REW do all that and just import the data for it or something.

I’m not an expert , but I am a thinker, and my gut tell me if we had this not only could we see the effects the correction has on excess GD to save a lot of time and multiple measurements which surly once a 2nd measurement is made it can not be a “true” representation of the original measurement the correction was based off of. But also I want to believe it would save us time running ETC functions to look for ringing (s)

Something tells me it’s all connected, seems almost a necessity and please correct me if I’m wrong.

Andrew

Richard, Andrew, Andrey, I am sorry I was not able to add any of the features discussed here in the 1.3.0 release

Another idea for new rePhase feature... (I had originally wrote in another thread, but copied again here, where it really belongs.)

When using "Tools" > "Order by ascending frequency", it only re-orders the 17 current filter sliders of just one single bank.
Could you include a new option to "Order ALL 16 banks by ascending frequency" please?
ie. I'm not saying "repeat the same job re-ordering each single bank's contents, repeat 16 times over for every bank because I'm too lazy to press the button 16 times myself" what I'm saying is "re-order all the current bands across all banks, possibly up to 16 banks x 17 bands each = 272 filters max, so that all 272 filters are in ascending frequency order, starting with lowest bass freq first at beginning of bank 01 and highest treble last at end of bank 16. "

That would be a very big help - because you typically start off making course EQ changes in bank 01, and work down to finer smaller adjustments going into new banks 02, 03, 04 etc. , till really tiny adjustments by bank 14, 15, 16, etc. but then when re-tweaking and fine-tuning again, looking for the sliders in a certain freq range, those nearest neighbour freq centres are spread out all over the place between numerous different banks, and you're hunting through all 16 banks to find them. even if you re-order each individual bank.
I've used a workaround solution to re-order all 16 banks by manually saving each of 16 banks EQ settings as text file and manually edit those in Notepad to extract the numerical values, which I can then import into a spreadsheet program to automatically re-order them and the export the ordered numbers back into Notepad and re-edit the text format back to rePhase EQ settings format with headers and footers in the correct places, splitting into 16 groups of 17 filters as needed and re-import those text files loading as EQ settings again for each of 16 banks back into rePhase.
I've done this successfully a few times now, but it's very long tedious manual process!!!! Plus danger of user error messing up something.
If there was an included automatic tool to do this across all 16 banks it would be really helpful. Please, please, please. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

That should be easy enough to do, and useful, thanks for the suggestion!
That said in many case you use different banks for different purpose, like speaker EQ in some banks and room EQ in others.
Ideally you should be able to choose which banks you want to reorder, but that would require more complicated user interfaces.

272 EQ points... are you really using all these? I can add a few additional banks if you need them

There is a problem with this approach though: it only works if all EQ banks use the same EQ type and phase relation...
Range can also be different from one bank to another

Yes, I know it would only work for properly if all 16 banks were using the same identical type of filters, because otherwise if one bank was set to "Contant Q / minimum phase" and another was "Raised cosine / linear phase" and you globally re-ordered all 272 filter banks by frequency, some filters bands from one EQ type might get placed elsewhere into a bank of different EQ type where they didn't actually belong, which even though their dB, Hz and Q values are the same numbers, would be a radical change in their actual response behaviour, thus messing up the shape of the curve.

However, being aware of that is all part and parcel of simply understanding what you're doing when using the software...
The best approach to fix this issue might be...

1.) Explain this pitfall to warn everyone in the update release notes text, as a disclaimer, so they're aware not to make global change of re-ordering all 16 banks if they are using a mixture of different types, for that reason.
2. ) Have a pop-up checkbox "Are you Sure? All EQ types will be reset to CONSTANT Q / MINIMUM PHASE default" so user can yes / no and proceed or think twice and avoid a mishap.
3.) Have a pop-up drop menu from that tool option asking which specific EQ type you want ALL filters to be reset to....?
4.) Have a way of assigning one specific EQ type for each individual filter band (!) and retain those 272 unique EQ type settings after sorting all the filters so that 100% integrity is preserved - but frankly I think that's going a bit too far with making the software more complicated than necessary.
(I'm happy to stick with one filter type and be able to use the global re-order, or to merely avoid using that tool if I'm having a few different types in use in the same project - although I can't think of an application. EQ'ing loudspeaker drivers which are minimum phase devices by nature has always worked for me with minimum phase EQ corrections in the Paragraphic Gain EQ section, along with any phase corrections in the Paragraphic Phase EQ section.)

5. Other option is to have a 16 tick boxes for each of the 16 banks to say include / don't include in the global re-order, so you could resort maybe 14 of them by freq which are all minimum phase, but leave two out which you might be using for something else like raised cosine, so they remain intact untouched. Or going further, have 272 include / don't include check boxes.

ANOTHER IDEA JUST OCCURED TO ME
You've already got 272 individual "Bypass" boxes for each filter in each bank, and "Bypass All" in the Tools drop-down menu simply bypasses the 17 filters in the current bank and the boxes turn red, but there isn't an overall bypass for all 16 banks together, without going through doing "Bypass All" 16 times for every bank.
Really the "Bypass All" function should be renamed "Bypass Bank" because it only works on the current bank, and another "Bypass Paragraphic EQ altogether" function should be added to do the whole lot.
I think the name "Bypass All" is rather ambiguous anyway - it doesn't bypass the other sections like "Paragraphic Phase EQ" or the crossover filters, it's only the current bank of the current paragraphic section in use.

"Range can also be different from one bank to another"
The range setting seems to only affect how far you can mouse-drag the grey sliders on the screen.
Adjusting the range afterwards doesn't subsequently affect the actual dB values of the filters you've already set. The set filters and their blue plotted curve stays the same even if you do change the slider range.
eg. If you have +/-12dB range and set one filter to +12dB value then shrink range to +/-3dB it doesn't change the actual setting of +12dB of that filter. What happens is the on-screen sliders only show +3dB at the top of their travel and the filter which is set to +12dB appears at the uppermost limit of its travel which (wrongly) reads +3dB on the slider scale, but the value is beyond that range and is still +12dB as it shows in the dB box and on the blue graph.
So I believe if you re-order all 16 banks, the actual filter settings dB values will be preserved, even if their slider appearance looks different when viewed from a different range - but that is the way it works anyway. So there's no real problem with the system working like that.

This does logically lead to yet another new feature request, that perhaps if a filter is set to +12dB and the slider range is only +/-3dB, maybe the slider which is maxed out at the top of it's travel shouldn't be dark grey like all the others (looking like it's showing +3dB on the scale) but perhaps change colour to light grey to show it's actual dB value is beyond the scale of the slider range currently being shown. This might avoid some confusion.

As always, I think rePhase is amazing! Whatever features you can add, thank you very much, it's all totally amazing!!!!!!

A 1.4.0 test version is online, working for the next 10 days for anyone willing to test it before the final 1.4.0 release
www.dropbox.com/s/iflbrd2awoqmvlt/rePhase_1.4.0_TEST.zip?dl=1
(time limit is there to avoid having potentially broken test versions of the software in circulation)

Please tell me if you find any problem or incompatibilities, or if you have suggestions for adjustments.

change log:
Please note: settings format might change in the final 1.4.0 release, so while playing with this test version keep a copy of your important setting files as saved with rephase 1.3.0 (or any prior stable version), as these are the only versions guaranteed to be compatible with the final 1.4.0 (and following) release.

Thank you Pos, brilliant work as always.
Look forward to trying it.

Hi Pos,
The new features are fantastic!
I'm delighted to see the EQ filter order sorting now works "THROUGHOUT BANKS" as well, which is very helpful.

Although myself, I've already done this job the hard way, painstakingly by exporting EQ as text files, and manually editing the format down in Notepad, then coping the numerical values into a spreadsheet, re-ordering them and re-assembling a new text file in identical format, using copy & paste - it's a slow job, first time took me hours, but now I can re-edit typical whole 272 filter exports in about 45 minutes, with extra help from my Corsair K55 keyboard which has six on-the-fly programmable macro keys that can memorize my key sequences for speeding up entry of repeating, complicated typing and copy 'n' paste operations.

Now, in rePhase 1.4.0, I can do that same job in a split second. That's amazing!

I was frustrated before (in rePhase 1.3.0) that I could only export text for the "Paragraphic Gain EQ" (Tools > Save EQ settings as...) but there was no similar text export tool option for the "Paragraphic Phase EQ", so even if I wanted to spend hours editing / manually re-ordering my phase EQ text files as well, I couldn't because I can't export those as text.

However, I'm very pleased to see in rePhase 1.4.0 that new feature sort order "THROUGHOUT BANKS" is included for both Phase EQ and Gain EQ, so I can finally have a way to sort all my phase EQ filters into a logical order too. That's brilliant.

Being able to BYPASS ALL banks quickly is also really helpful. Thank you.

Also, it's very nice to finally be able to drag the blue EQ curve around on the screen with the mouse and CTRL+Click - that's obviously a big new feature, but I've found in practice while it's great for coarse EQ adjustments to start with, but rather too jumpy to make very tiny tweaks once you're "nearly there" with almost perfect shape. I still need to fine-tune nudge the "Hz" or "dB" or "Q" values individually rather than have my clumsy mouse-drag movement of two parameters dB and Hz simultaneously, I just mess things up. If we could control one parameter at a time by mouse-drag or mouse-wheel that would be easier.

Hi Richard,

That was your suggestion, I am glad you like it
I will add a confirmation box in the final release, as these operations are almost impossible to revert.

Have you tried the graphical EQ manipulation and frequency response export (which were also part of your suggestions ) ?

The graphical EQ manipulation will be improved in the final version, as the mouse wheel will be used to alter the Q value.