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TOPIC: Help setting gain structure

Help setting gain structure 4 months 3 weeks ago #35659

  • ragu
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Hello,

My setup is:

Oppo 103 (HDMI Out 1)-> NanoAVR DL (HDMI Out) -> NanoAVR HDA (Analog Outs to 5.1 active speakers)

I am learning about the concept of gain structure, but I'm wondering if there is a step by step procedure for optimizing it in a system like mine?

Thanks in advance,
Ragu
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 3 weeks ago #35683

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Anyone?
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 3 weeks ago #35705

  • PsyCLown
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I am not sure whether there is a step by step procedure, but I can tell you what I'd do - however there may be a better way.

I'd set the Oppo to 90% max volume or so as this is the main source and I am unsure whether it can output at 100% volume without any clipping. The MiniDSP's I'd make sure to not go above 0dB - that is for both of them. With the analogue outputs you could use an osciloscope to check if its clipping, or perhaps even a multimeter to check the outut voltage if we know what the units can handle before clipping (I think it is 2V?) and then make a note of the master volume level before it starts clipping.
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 3 weeks ago #35708

I have a very similar setup and was about to post a new thread on this exact topic.

I also have an Oppo 103. Here's my setup using all HDMI connections:
Oppo 103 -> NanoAVR DL -> Onkyo TX-RZ710

The output volume cannot be adjusted for HDMI connections on the Oppo. From the Oppo manual: "the volume control only affects the analog audio output. It does not apply to digital audio output (HDMI, etc.)"

When I first installed the NanoAVR DL into my signal chain, I was not impressed. It sounded distorted and compressed. I was really disappointed considering all the glowing reviews of Dirac Live. After a while I realized there must be some clipping happening during the audio processing. So, I reduced the master volume on the NanoAVR DL and suddenly the quality of the sound improved dramatically. In fact, it was fantastic, I am extremely excited what Dirac Live is doing to improve my sound system!

But, the question I still have is, how far do I reduce the master volume on the NanoAVR DL? I currently have it somewhere between -8 and -10, but it's just guesswork trying to make sure I eliminate any clipping. Our system is mostly used for watching movies, and we like to crank it up loud. Reducing the master volume on the NanoAVR affects the overall volume we can achieve in the system.

I know these request have been asked before, but they bear repeating.

1. There needs to be a clipping indicator. This can be in the app and/or computer software. I tested the Dirac Live software demo before I bought the NanoAVR, and that program does have a clipping indicator. I feel this is an important feature missing on the NanoAVR. If it could detect and report any clipping, that would be a lot easier than having to use an osciloscope or testing the output voltage of the signal.

2. When connected to the computer software you can view the numerical master volume setting. This value is not available in the app. I'm OCD about knowing the exact number the volume is on. I find myself going to the trouble to connect my computer to the NanoAVR just to make sure the volume is still exactly where I expect it to be :)
Last Edit: 4 months 3 weeks ago by [email protected]. Reason: grammar
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 2 weeks ago #35773

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[email protected] wrote:
But, the question I still have is, how far do I reduce the master volume on the NanoAVR DL? I currently have it somewhere between -8 and -10, but it's just guesswork trying to make sure I eliminate any clipping.

Ditto. Is there a way to figure out the MV on the NanoAVR DL that avoids clipping? @devteam?

I know these request have been asked before, but they bear repeating.

+1 to your requests as well.

Best,
Ragu
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 2 weeks ago #35774

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ragu wrote:
[email protected] wrote:
But, the question I still have is, how far do I reduce the master volume on the NanoAVR DL? I currently have it somewhere between -8 and -10, but it's just guesswork trying to make sure I eliminate any clipping.

Ditto. Is there a way to figure out the MV on the NanoAVR DL that avoids clipping? @devteam?

I know these request have been asked before, but they bear repeating.

+1 to your requests as well.

Best,
Ragu

As far as I am aware, the NanoAVR will be able to play a 0dB audio file at 0dB master volume without clipping.
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 1 week ago #35842

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PsyCLown wrote:
As far as I am aware, the NanoAVR will be able to play a 0dB audio file at 0dB master volume without clipping.

You mean play a signal at 0dbFS level at maximum MV without clipping?

If so, I set MV to maximum on the NanoAVR DL *and* HDA and then use the gain controls on my active speakers to calibrate for reference level playback?

Could someone from Minidsp please confirm this? My understanding here is not as robust as I'd like it to be.

Thanks,
Ragu
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 1 week ago #35932

  • devteam
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Dear All.

Thanks for the feedback. RMS meters on the input section is indeed a good idea.. Something we can certainly consider for the future.

DevTeam
MiniDSP, building a DIY DSP community one board at a time.
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 1 week ago #35948

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devteam wrote:
Thanks for the feedback.

Could you please provide an answer to my question?

Can I set the MV to maximum on the NanoAVR DL and NanoAVR HDA in my setup and still be guaranteed that the signal out of the HDA to my actives won't clip?

If the answer is not a simple yes or no, please explain so we can advance our understanding of this topic.

Best,
Ragu
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Help setting gain structure 4 months 1 week ago #35950

  • john.reekie
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Set the nanoAVR DL to -10 dB. (Isn't that the default? It used to be.) That way Dirac Live, which has a maximum boost of 10 dB, won't clip the output.
I am not miniDSP support.

"You must ask the right questions." - Dr. Alfred Lanning's hologram.
-> Have you read the User Manual??
-> Have you drawn and posted a diagram?
-> Have you posted a screenshot?
-> Have you posted your config file?
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