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TOPIC: Is Dirac mistake ?

Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #23922

  • john.reekie
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RenPa, I have it on my list to do, to try and do some measurements to help you. But on the one hand you say:
RenPa wrote:
the silence of tech support about this very problem

And then you say:
RenPa wrote:
MiniDsp tech support is examplary, don't worry.

I guess I feel like I'm totally wasting my time. Yes/no? Thanks ;)
I am not miniDSP support.

"You must ask the right questions." - Dr. Alfred Lanning's hologram.
-> Have you read the User Manual??
-> Have you drawn and posted a diagram?
-> Have you posted a screenshot?
-> Have you posted your config file?
Last Edit: 3 years 7 months ago by john.reekie.
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #23923

  • RenPa
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john.reekie wrote:
RenPa, I have it on my list to do, to try and do some measurements to help you. But on the one hand you say:
RenPa wrote:
the silence of tech support about this very problem

And then you say:
RenPa wrote:
MiniDsp tech support is examplary, don't worry.

I guess I feel like I'm totally wasting my time. Yes/no? Thanks ;)

Sorry sir I do not understand. You have been very helpfull since the beginning. I never had the intention to be disrespectfull to you. I apology if I hurt you in a way that I do not know how.
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #23924

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Let me try and do the measurements I said I would, when I set my HT up again tomorrow with different speakers. miniDSP needs to restructure this forum to separate "minidsp support" from "community support". I've said this so many times and I just give up. I really suspect that your issue is related to low-frequency noise, but I could be completely wrong. Let me see what I can do tomorrow, and that will be it. See you then.
I am not miniDSP support.

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-> Have you read the User Manual??
-> Have you drawn and posted a diagram?
-> Have you posted a screenshot?
-> Have you posted your config file?
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #23936

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@RenPA, @devteam, this is the measurement that I get when I run a stereo measurement on just my front left and right speakers (single sweep). I haven't disabled bass management, but you can see how the noise level at "10 Hz" is very low, unlike your measurement.



However, the first time I did the measurement, I had the fan over the stove in the kitchen turned on (next room), and this was the result:



So, I don't know, but I suspect that you have low frequency noise (that you can't hear) that is upsetting the calculation of the impulse response. If you have a support ticket open with miniDSP then I assume you can send miniDSP your project file and they can ask Dirac Research about it.

Hope that helps, best of luck.

J

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I am not miniDSP support.

"You must ask the right questions." - Dr. Alfred Lanning's hologram.
-> Have you read the User Manual??
-> Have you drawn and posted a diagram?
-> Have you posted a screenshot?
-> Have you posted your config file?
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #23948

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john.reekie wrote:
@RenPA, @devteam, this is the measurement that I get when I run a stereo measurement on just my front left and right speakers (single sweep). I haven't disabled bass management, but you can see how the noise level at "10 Hz" is very low, unlike your measurement.

(...)

However, the first time I did the measurement, I had the fan over the stove in the kitchen turned on (next room), and this was the result:
(...)

So, I don't know, but I suspect that you have low frequency noise (that you can't hear) that is upsetting the calculation of the impulse response. If you have a support ticket open with miniDSP then I assume you can send miniDSP your project file and they can ask Dirac Research about it.

Hope that helps, best of luck.

J

Thank you very much to have took the time for this test. In fact, miniDSP asked yesterday for my project files. Let's see.
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #24038

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john.reekie wrote:
@RenPA, @devteam, (...)

If you have a support ticket open with miniDSP then I assume you can send miniDSP your project file and they can ask Dirac Research about it.

Hope that helps, best of luck.

J

Dear John,
an update. At the tech support suggestion I put the bluray player (Cambridge 752BD bought in december 2015) out of the chain. For the test, the chain was : laptop to nano to avr to display. And I got correct Dirac curve for both left and right front channels. I reset Cambridge to factory settings and put it back into the chain and do measures with Dirac. I got correct results for left and right channel with Dirac.
How to explain that? Do I have a problem with the bluray?
I remember, many weeks ago when I first connect NanoAvr-dl between the bluray and the receiver and when I put on all the gears in the order asked for in the manual (first the display on followed by AVR on followed by connect Nano to the outlet and finally bluray on) I got a green sceen and snowy screen in the tv for a moment and after a while, I got the image. This week-end, when I reset the bluray I got the same thing before to take Dirac measurements .
Does it make any sense to think that hdmi connecting sequence has messed up something into the bluray hardware that induce the problem? Would send the bluray to repair ?
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #24052

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But it's working now though? I would just leave it :) HDMI has a thing called EDID which propagates between devices, which can sometimes cause issues.
I am not miniDSP support.

"You must ask the right questions." - Dr. Alfred Lanning's hologram.
-> Have you read the User Manual??
-> Have you drawn and posted a diagram?
-> Have you posted a screenshot?
-> Have you posted your config file?
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The following user(s) said Thank You: devteam

Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 7 months ago #24077

  • RenPa
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john.reekie wrote:
But it's working now though? I would just leave it :) HDMI has a thing called EDID which propagates between devices, which can sometimes cause issues.

It seems to be fixed. In truth, I did not complete a full cycle of measurements.I need a brake of nano for a couple of weeks.
In front of all those mysteries, I am still debating if I continue this journey.

Again thank you very much for your very accurate suggestions that help me to narrowing the field of possibles problems.
Last Edit: 3 years 7 months ago by RenPa.
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 3 months ago #26359

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A short update.
I finally hooked up again my NanoAvr-DL unit into my system downstream the bd player (Cambridge CXU) before the ROTEL avr . Graphs from Dirac for left and right channels are now fine.
So as bizarre as it seems, the faulty 752D unit (now discontinued) was inputing some weird signal to the right channel that Dirac read but not REW.
Go figures! :ohmy:
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 3 months ago #26417

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john.reekie wrote:
@RenPA, @devteam, (...)

So, I don't know, but I suspect that you have low frequency noise (that you can't hear) that is upsetting the calculation of the impulse response. If you have a support ticket open with miniDSP then I assume you can send miniDSP your project file and they can ask Dirac Research about it.

Hope that helps, best of luck.

J

To DEVTEAM,
A follow up.
Saturday, I reproduced (by hazard) the same problem (false reading with the right channel) that I had when I openned a thicket with you in March but this time it was with my new bd-player. Imagine how it scared me.
I send you an email this week-end related to the ticket openned about my problem in March with screen captures and waiting for your response.

But, I think that it worth to tell what I did this week-end, maybe it could help somebody somewhere.

What I wanted to do?
2 calibrations. One for cinema, 5.1 system,(all speakers set to small, bass managed) and one for music, stereo only, fronts set to large, no sub,no center, no surrounds, sub main power to off, no bass management.

What were my settings?

1- For cinema EQ with Dirac Live

Nano Utility program: source=hdmi; channel mode=AUTO.
Receiver dispalyed: multi channel PCM
Dirac Live: I set "Choose system configuration" to 7.1 as instructed at p23 of the manual, and I quote:"This setting should be based on the number of HDMI Audio channels passing through the nanoAVR DL, not the number of speakers being driven by the AVR. To ensure that 7.1 content will be processed by Dirac Live, select 7.1 Speaker System."
Measurements failed, only left and right fronts were measured and I received a message"low readings" impossible to continue.

I changed "channel mode" to 7.1 into Nano and "system configuration" to 5.1 into Dirac. Measurements = OK.

2- For Music EQ with Dirac Live
Nano Utility program: source=hdmi; channel mode=AUTO.
Receiver displayed: 2ch PCM
Dirac live "system configuration" set to STEREO
Measurements failed to the right channel exactly like in March!!!

I changed "channel mode" to 7.1, left Dirac settings to stereo. Then Receiver displayed "Multi-channels PCM" .
Measurements = OK for left and right channels FEW !!

What does it tell to you ? Do I have a bad NanoAvr-DL unit? Is it a software problem? a HDMI issue?

Now. More informations maybe related to John commentary quoted before.

During this process, I discovered that putting the Nano Avr-DL unit into the chain created a humm. I spent many hours this week-end on Internet and on my system to find the source. It is important to note that without the unit my system is completly silent. No humm at all. When I put the NanoAvr-DL and set the player to on= humm!!
Finally, I found the source: cable of the cable TV !!. When the cable is connected, even if the step-top box (cable decoder) is off = humm. Disconnect the cable= no humm!
It is a 60hz humm.
I followed the advises of a technician in a forum. First, don't call the cable company, they will not know what you are talking about. !! Second: you must go OUTSIDE of your house, find where the cable is splitted for the FIRST TIME by a splitter and BEFORE the splitter make a correct ground with a wire connected properly to the mass, ideally connected to the rod stick in the ground. VoilĂ .
My system returned to be quite as before.
Does it make sense to relate the faulse right channel measurement in stereo mod to the 60hz cable-tv humm? If the Nano is unplugged, does the humm (that I do not hear it then) changed hypocritly the measures?
It was late yesterday night when I finally get rid of the damned humm and had no time to try again to EQ my system for music listening purposes. Do you think that it could be the cause of the faulty measurements fo my right channel in stereo ?
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 3 months ago #26498

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On the hum front, it seems that a bad ground of the cable was a part of the problem. A faint hum remains, and all indicates that the hdmi connection of the set-top box could be the source.
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Is Dirac mistake ? 3 years 2 months ago #26540

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I have found the soultion for the faint hum (bad hdmi cable it seems) and the graph of the right channel response when Nano Utility program channel mode is stereo and receiver is set to 2 channel PCM for stereo listening session shows the same wrong reading. Hopefully Devteam will have an idea. But on 5.1 settings, Dirac makes good results.
Thank you.
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